X-Message-Number: 10021
Date: Thu, 09 Jul 1998 02:16:37 -0400
From: Paul Wakfer <>
Subject: Re: CryoNet #9995 Re: Eighth Annual Canadian Cryonics Pool Party
References: <>

> Message #9995
> From:  (Randy Smith)
> Newsgroups: sci.cryonics
> Subject: Re: Eighth Annual Canadian Cryonics Pool Party
> Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 04:57:54 GMT
> Message-ID: <>
> References: <6nr9vh$1c8$>

Randy Smith wrote:
> On Mon, 06 Jul 1998 15:48:47 -0400, Ben Best <>
> wrote:
> >Paul has also recently returned from giving cryonics
> >presentations in Japan & Taiwan.

This much is true, see details below.

> >He believes the impact of the Asians
> >upon cryopreservation technology may become immense.

This is Ben Best's exaggeration or misinterpretation of my thoughts.
I don't "believe" it. I only think that it is possible. And not upon the
*technology*, but on the size of the movement - the number of patients
and people signed up.

> Regarding your views on the possible impact of Asians on cryonics, can
> you give us a summary of the evidence that supports this. Did your
> recent trip give you solid evidence that cryonics could make inroads
> there? Were there a great many people interested in cryonics when you
> were there? (Pardon my nosiness...)

No problem. I am happy to report on my trip.
Rather than trying to address any of your ideas about Asians and
cryonics (which I have snipped) I will just report why I went and what I
did there.

I spent 3 1/2 days in Taipei, Taiwan and 4 days in Tokyo, Japan. All
expenses were paid by the company which I consulted for in Taipei. In
addition, I was paid a small daily fee for my cryonics consulting in
Taipei. I had never been to the "far east", had always wanted to, and
would have gone for only expenses if necessary.

In Taipei:

1. I stayed at a 5-star hotel, was driven everywhere in Mercedes
limousines, and was even escorted to dance spots in the evening.
Everything was provided such that I never needed to exchange any money
into Taiwanese currency.

2. The company that I visited is attempting to market cryonics in
Taiwan, and they needed someone knowledgeable to convince the Taiwanese
government authorities that it is not a scam but a legitimate and
reasonable thing to do. That company has an office staffed with three
full-time people (young women) and a manager, Stephen Tseng, who has
visited cryonics organizations in the US and whom I had met 3 years
earlier when he signed a 5 year contract with BioPreservation to be
their exclusive marketing agent in Taiwan and China. The company is now
owned by a Mr Chen Wei Hsiang who appears to be quite wealthy with major

3. I ate dinner in a very high class restaurant (about an eight course
meal, as I recall). At our large table was a woman member of the
legislature, a chairman of a securities company, a high official of the
Lion's Club, the son of the owner of the 5-star hotel (Formosa Regent)
at which I was staying, the president of a refrigeration engineering
company, and the commanding officer of the Criminal Investigation Corp
of the Taipei Municipal Police Headquarters. At the table next to ours
was the chief district attorney of Taipei to which I was introduced. He
happened to be hosting all the department head of the Taipei Police
Headquarters and the person at my table was time-slicing between the two

4. I testified in court before a woman judge about the true nature of
cryonics and that I was present at the signing of the above mentioned

5. I addressed a committee of the Taiwanese legislature which was
interested in hearing about both cryonics and cloning at one afternoon
session. At the beginning of the committee hearing, an official from the
department of health was very negative about the legitimacy of cryonics.
However, after my talk detailing exactly how it was done and that is was
highly damaging with small chances only better than the alternatives, he
stated that he had misunderstood and that he now had no objections to
the practice. After the hearing adjourned, I happened to be waiting for
the elevator right near him. I took the initiative and asked him clearly
and directly whether *any part* of the cryonics procedures from bedside
standby to long-term care in liquid nitrogen would be illegal in Taiwan.
He answer was an unequivocal no! All aspects of cryonics practice would
be legally permissible in Taiwan! There also was extensive press
coverage of the committee hearing.

6. On the afternoon of the day before I departed, I gave a slide
presentation to an audience of about 30 invited doctors and scientists
from the Taipei area. This also had extensive press coverage. It lasted
about 3 hours (things take much longer when there has to be translation)
and concluded with questions and answers. One scientist who spoke fluent
English had clearly been sent there to "shoot me down" and gave the
standard cryobiologist type objections. However, I believe that I dealt
with him quite effectively, by simply replying to his statement that I
"had shown no evidence that cryonics would work" (which from the
traditional - and proper - scientific viewpoint of the meaning of
"evidence" is quite correct. No one has yet shown any such evidence!),
with the statement that neither he nor anyone else had shown that it
would not work and that cryonics is one of the very few special cases
where it makes sense to try something which has not yet been
scientifically validated - simply because there is no alternative but
certain death. He had no answer to that and the audience appeared to
agree with me.

7. Mr Chen Wei Hsiang has appointed me as his representative to either
conclude agreements with a US cryonics organization to provide services
for his marketing efforts, or to establish an organization, a facility,
and personnel to provide such services. I have formulated and sent an
agreement to him detailing possible methods for proceeding.

In Japan:

1. This was a side trip, originally planned to visit an old Canadian
friend who is working in Tokyo teaching English. I stayed at his place
(over an hour by train from downtown Tokyo) and, with his guidance,
quickly learned to negotiate the trains, subways, restaurants, etc. by

2. I spent the afternoon of the first full day being given a tour of
part of Tokyo by a very pleasant Japanese lady futurist (Rei Uda) who
would be my interpreter at the proceedings of the next two days. That
evening I met David Walsh a Canadian cryonicist who is fluent in many
languages including Japanese and Chinese and who lives and works in
Tokyo. Unfortunately, Kurt Schoedel, an American cryonicist who I had
met in the US several years ago, had made prior major plans to be away
from Tokyo that weekend.

3. Next day I went into town for an interview with the Japanese Wired
Magazine which Mr Takaaki Kaburagi of the Metamorphosis Society had
arranged for me. This was both a recorded interview and "on the street"

4. On the afternoon of the next day, I gave my presentation to a group
of 10 interested persons invited by Mr Kaburagi in a small conference
room (all rooms are small in Tokyo :) of a restaurant in the Ginza
district. It was well received, but unfortunately, I didn't know that
there was an absolute time limit to our use of the room (the restaurant
closed at 5 PM on sunday afternoon!) and with the translation dragging
things out (David Walsh did part of it), there was no time for

All in all, I had a great time for my very first trip to East Asia.
I must say that it was very pleasant to be treated with great courtesy
and respect.

-- Paul --

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