X-Message-Number: 14458
Date: Tue, 12 Sep 2000 16:25:08 -0600
From: Fred Chamberlain <>
Subject: Where are "They"?

Date:  9/12/2000
From:  Fred Chamberlain
Re:    Where are "They"?


Concerning:

>From: Doug Skrecky <> 
>Subject: if so, where are they?
>In Message #14436 Thomas Donaldson <> wrote:

>> NONE decide to come here. I do not know of any PLAUSIBLE 
>> theory for that. At the same time, with an infinite past, 
>> the problem of "Where are they?" becomes even more pressing.

>The only two even remotely plausible theories that might 
>account for the seeming absence of ETI that I have heard are:

>1. ETI's in remote areas of the multiverse are unable 
>to visit us yet. This has a few varients:

>1A. They may exist in areas that are topologically separated 
>from our bubble universe. (another bubble universe)

>1B. They are on the way, but have not yet had enough time 
>to reach us.  Our local universe was too hot to travel into, 
>until about 10 billion years ago.

>  2. ETI's are in fact already here. This has an interesting varient:

2A. We exist in a cyberspace.


(REPLY)


Why a "third alternative", as suggested in Sagan's "Contact"?  Intelligent
species (which survive) will eventually master nanotechnology and translate
their individual identities into non-evolved platforms (in our case,
non-biological forms), capable of being backed up and capable of experiencing
one another in virtual realities as well as in real environments.


Under such circumstances, most local travel and communication (sub light-year)
would be information based, vs. mass-transport based.  Virtual reality will be
necessary in any case (at least at times) for any species which has
accelerated
the pace of thought to the point where physical means of communication (like
speaking and listening to the resulting acoustic waveforms) no longer
suffices.


None of this requires really tough technology (as might be required to whisk
megatons between stars at trans-light or hyper-light speeds).  The advances of
moving from evolved to non-evolved forms seems almost certain come early in
the
development of intelligent species [again, if they do not destroy themselves,
via nuclear, biotech, or grey goo (nanotech) scenarios].


Given that "they" will be able to do this [accomplish local travel and
communication (sub light-year) on the basis of information relay vs.
mass-transport], they will concurrently imagine that other "theys" have
figured
out how to do it too, and begin "listening" in earnest (al la "Contact") to
see
what kind of interstellar "theys" may be "saying hello" with prime numbers and
much, much more.


The ETI's we would like to believe are there may very well be there, but we
are
unlikely (presently) to be equipped to hear what they are saying, any more
than
ants or sparrows are apt to be able to tune into our TV programs, or even make
much sense of what we say sitting on park benches.  We just don't have the
right equipment, or the right level of thinking and software, and (to be
realistic) won't have even the foggiest notion of what the equipment, thinking
or software will be like, until we've managed the kind of self-transformation
which is required to be in a position to use these things.


Meanwhile, we are growing older at a ferocious rate; many of us will die and
blow away (as measured in ETI time) in the next few seconds, if we don't do
something about it!  It is clear that we can do something about it, the
biggest
question being what kind of future we might find when we "wake up" (see
http://www.alcor.org/lifeqst4.htm for an uploading story.)


in 1992, Linda Chamberlain and I sent a "Happy Holidays and a Safe Journey
into
the Next Millennium" card to many we knew, mostly Alcor Members, with the
following poem, which dealt specifically with the subject of this email,
namely
"Where are 'They'?":


UNIVERSAL DOORWAYS

(FRC-12/92)


Precious memories are our treasures,
Carried with us as we fly,
Through the centuries just before us,
Headed ever toward the sky.

Humans, we, from atoms risen,
Short-lived soon may cease to be,
As new molecules release us,
From genetic slavery.

Seas of space which all surround us,
Studded bright with points of light,
Call out to our deepest nature,
To grow wings and rise in flight.

Flight perhaps as fragile photons,
Patterns frozen 'till we reach,
Friendly shores which welcome us,
And warm us on a friendly beach.

Certainly we may suppose that,
Others like us have foreseen,
Traveling depths of space in search of,
Other places sweet and green.

Just as we will welcome them,
So we hope they'll welcome us,
Fellow space-time voyagers with,
Extropic topics to discuss. 


Boundless Life,

Fred Chamberlain, President/CEO () 
Alcor Life Extension Foundation 
Non-profit cryotransport services since 1972. 
7895 E. Acoma Dr., Suite 110, Scottsdale AZ 85260-6916 
Membership Information: (877) GO-ALCOR (462-5267) 
Phone (480) 905-1906 FAX (480) 922-9027
 for general requests
<http://www.alcor.org/>http://www.alcor.org

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