X-Message-Number: 15104 From: "George Smith" <> References: <> Subject: Re: Souls on Ice - CryoNet #15099 Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 14:21:00 -0800 I wanted to make a few observations in response to Joseph Kehoe's comments on religion and cryonics (message #15099) I see no reason for there to be any problem between those who believe in some form of life after death and cryonics. Yes, there do exist a few religions which reject certain medical interventions such as blood transfusions and even birth control pills. However, it is my understanding that most religions have no problem with heart resuscitation techniques and numerous other modern medical "miracles". In this sense, I think that it is fairly clear that the majority of religions have no problem with efforts to medically intervene as technology continues to shrink the meaning of what constitutes "death". Second, I would speculate that there are darn few cryonicists who believe that cryonics will forever defeat physical death and thereby trespass upon religious afterlife territory. Perhaps uploading schemes might fit that ticket, but cryonics, per se, is a life extension method and not necessarily a guarantee to life eternal in the physical (not that I am in the least against that!). ALL organizations (what are referred to as "superorganisms in THE LUCIFER PRINCIPLE) thrive on "brainwashing" and "persecution". Religions constitute only one form of organization. For example, I remember once having a heated argument with an Objectivist in which he claimed he was never affected by emotion. As I pointed out the clear physical signals of his anger (flushed cheeks, tense lips, raised shoulders, frowning eyebrows) he only became more adamant (and angry). As a staunch atheist he denied that Objectivism is a religion, yet his behavior was identical to the most radical true believer of any religious body I have met. Finally, is it wise to denigrate the majority of people (members of religions) if we both want cryonics to survive and grow? What is to be gained by insulting people who do not share your world view? And what can be lost? If most members of your own family are very religious and you want your intentions for cryonic suspension to be honored (or at the very least unopposed) by them, wouldn't it be wiser to try to demonstrate that THIS form of body "disposal" does not clash with THEIR religious beliefs (if that is possible)? I know how frustrating it can sometimes be to feel as if one were surrounded by morons, but please consider the importance of not unnecessarily creating problems for yourself. Best wishes, George Smith Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=15104