X-Message-Number: 15345
From: 
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 11:22:02 EST
Subject: Wakfer 1

Point by point, to Wakfer and Platt and anyone else who cares to engage. And 
I'll continue to try to resist the temptation to sarcasm, ad hominen stuff 
etc. 

First, Wakfer's # 15341 concerning my post #15333 about Fahy:

Wakfer characterizes my post as "mischievous" and as maybe causing "grievous 
harm to Dr. Fahy," because the Internet will bring forth anything containing 
the name "Fahy" and, supposedly, enemies of cryonics will then sabotage 
Fahy's career.

1. It was Wakfer, not I, who first broke the recent requested ban against 
mention of "Fahy" on Cryonet. Wakfer argues, disingenously, that HIS post, 
with Fahy's name,  was merely a scientific announcement. But it was the 
CRYONET venue that was deemed dangerous per the original request not to 
mention the name, not the content.

2. Wakfer knows perfectly well that I cannot and will not let accusations and 
misinformation go unanswered.  He could have kept his counsel and let the 
matter subside. By repeating and extending the discussion of Fahy, he acts 
against the advice he gives me.

3. Fahy's name, along with extensive quotations from his 1988 deposition, has 
been on the CI web site for about two years. The deposition itelf has been in 
the public domain for more than 10 years. Meryman and many others have 
undoubtedly been aware of Fahy's sympathies for much longer. 

Has that hurt him? Wakfer says Fahy "has already suffered enormously over the 
years in lack of honors and privileges from those in his own profession." 
Just think about that for a moment.

If it is true, it supports what I have said--that Meryman and others have 
known very well for a very long time about Greg's cryonics sympathies. In 
that case, a little more exposure seems hardly likely to matter.

On the other hand, Greg himself said, in his 1988 deposition, that "I am 
widely acknowledged to be one of the world's leading researchers on mammalian 
organ cryopreservation." If this statement, sworn under penalty of perjury, 
is true--as I believe it is, along with the rest of the deposition--then 
exactly how much Greg suffered from his connections seems unclear. If there 
is ever a trial of the Society for Cryobiology, maybe we will learn exactly 
what "honors" and "privileges" (Wakfer's words) were denied him because of 
his being a semi-closet cryonicist.

4. Fahy is no longer working under Meryman. He is working now, I believe, for 
21CM, which will certainly not fire him or penalize him for cryonics 
sympathies. As for any future recognitiion and honors, these seem likely to 
come primarily from advances in organ cryopreservation, and it would be 
ludicrous to expect that any breakthrough in this area would fail to bring 
him appropriate recognition.

5. Wakfer suggests that CI pay legal expenses for a cryonicist to sue the 
Society for Cryobiology for refusal to accept his membership. 

We would certainly consider such a proposal. But to give our case maximum 
strength, the person involved should preferably be someone with documented 
scientific credentials. Better yet, it should be someone already a member, 
telling them formally that he is a cryonicist and then suing if they try to 
expel him. I would personally contribute to the legal expenses, and I would 
recommend to the CI Board that CI contribute. Fahy himself would be the best 
candidate, but there are probably others. 

In years past, we offered to pay travel expenses, first class, plus an 
honorarium, to any first-rank cryobiologist who would agree to a formal 
debate about cryonics. There were no takers. I would love to get some of 
those people on the witness stand for cross examination.

Robert Ettinger
Cryonics Institute
Immortalist Society
http://www.cryonics.org

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