X-Message-Number: 15800 References: <> Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 12:58:43 +0000 From: "Joseph Kehoe" <> Subject: [off topic] Ludittes Hi, Some replies to the luditte thing. Imagine owning the patent on the rice genome. It has not happened yet but what if it did. We should really be thinking about these things now. Genetic engineering and nano will have profound affects on everyones lives. Of course some people are afraid that they will become the sole preserve of large multinationals or governments. We should take those worries seriously and do something about them now. We need to sort out the ethical issues in advance. I never said: progress is bad Everything that anti-technologists say is correct I do say Technology can be used badly Some things anti-technologists are worried about are valid concerns Multinationals have tried to steamroller these technologies in without consultation. They have handled the entire thing very badly and turned a lot of people against genetic engineering. A more open approach would have made them more friends. We do not fully understand how genes affect organisms. That is giving rise to some concern regarding changing the gene sequence in foodstuffs. If there are any problems we will not find out for a decade or two and then it is too late. Remember DDT? Remember Thaledamide? I don't think Industry does. That being said it is hard to have rational discussions with people holding "religious" beliefs (e.g. Creationism). I can see way to convince them about the benefits of technology but we should try bring as many people along as possible. Answers to other replies The article on The mid-west farmers and seed control came from the London Independent (National Paper in Britian) last year some time. I do not have it stored anywhere. Farmers in India, China and most of the undeveloped world grow their own seed. Roundup is sprayed on crop, just not near harvest and not very often. The point about Montsanto was that they lied about the crops they were testing. If we only have 5% of the actual gene pool saved then no amount of nano can bring them back. About owning your own genes - If a company can patent one of your genes, then it is NOT your property is it? >>Poverty, slavery, war and sickness occur more now than at any >>time in the past. > >Absolutely NOT true. So wrong as to be indefensible. This one sentence >shows that you've not done a single iota of homework to back it up. No >offense meant to you here, but I have to call it as it is, and this is a >false statement, on every count. Could you name that time in the past when there were more people suffering from sickness, famine and war than now? If you can do that then I was wrong. Just name that time. You will need a time when approx. 3 billion are malnorished 27 million are slaves (not including people who live under despots) there is a major (at least one) war every day of the year To help you out if you go back more than 50 years you will fail on the first count as the total population will be less than 2.5 bn That there is also more wealth now than at any time but that does not detract from the above. The 1% of the worlds population having a college education may be wrong but I do see how 8% could possibly be right. I will check up on it. Joseph. Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=15800