X-Message-Number: 16786
From: "Trygve Bauge" <>
References: <>
Subject: Re: Elizabeth and cell storage.
Date: Sun, 1 Jul 2001 22:29:11 +0200

To cryonet,
Attached is a polite and helpful letter that Chris Benatar wrote to
He too seems opposed to digging up and freezing the burried,
but he expressed himself in a cultivated manner,
trying to hold out the option of at least freezing some cell samples.

I submit this letter to Cryonet for two reasons:
First in the hope that others will learn from this letter,
and be more helpful and polite in their responses to post mortem requests,
and secondly to ask C.I. and Alcor/Cells-4-Life, if these will consider
freezing cell samples from people that have been burried?

Or is that too, a service without a present provider or only reserved for
pre mortem sign ups?


Trygve Bauge

----- Original Message -----
From: <>
To: <>
Sent: Monday, June 18, 2001 6:49 AM
Subject: Elizabeth

> Hi Trygve,
> Just thought I would send you a copy of the e-mail I sent to Elizabeth
> I am happy to try to help her out and will be happy to help her setup a
> facility here if she cannot be convinced to give up and providing she has
> sufficient finances for such a bold venture. My feeling is that she really
> just needs grief councelling but we cannot force that on her. If you are
> intrested, I will keep you updated on what comes out of it.
> Regards
> Chris
> Message follows:
> Hello Elizabeth,
> I apologise for the long delay in sending this - I have been away on
> holiday. Let me introduce myself. I live just outside Sydney in Australia.
> I came to Australia 3.5 years ago from the UK. During my time in the UK I
> was quite involved with cryonics. Since I have been in Australia I still
> follow the news about cryonics but do not get very involved so much.
> There is a small group of people intrested in cryonics in Australia (maybe
> 6 or 8 - I am not sure). Most people are signed up with either Alcor or CI
> (Cryonics Institute) which are both based in America (there is also
> smaller company (also in America) called Transtime but I don't know if
> still take patients - I have heard very little about them). If all of
> organisations refuse to take on your case, then you are very limited in
> your options.
> You could setup an Australian registered company and arrange for the
> suspension through your own company. This may not be as difficult as it
> sounds and you would probably get more co-operation for that from the US
> companies than you may expect considering their reluctance to deal with
> directly.
> If you were to setup your own cryonics facility, based in Australia, you
> would probably be able to convince most if not maybe even all Australian
> cryonicists to change to you as their service provider. Unfortunatly
> setting up a cryonics facility is likely to be very expensive and you
> need a lot of upfront cash (hundreds of thousands of Australian dollars).
> You may be able to reduce costs by renting equipment instead of buying and
> in the case of your father bypassing the need for expensive
> cryopreservatives (chemicals). A better alternative would be to get a
> tissue sample which contains his DNA that may be used later to clone him
> but remember that the clone will not have your fathers memories and may
> have a different personality.
> The reason that you have probably not had a good response to your requests
> for help is the long time involved without suspension. It is an
> fact that cryonics is limited in its likelyhood of sucess. Most people
> that more than 24 hours without suspension means that revival chances are
> virtually zero. Some may accept up to a week without suspension before
> giving up. Since it is nearly 3 months that your father has not been
> suspended, it is likely to be most peoples opinion that there is no
> realistic chance of revival. This is based on what is known about the
> brain, how the body breaks down after death and how the structure of the
> brain is important for memories and personality. Most organisations do not
> want their public image damaged by taking cases where the chance of
> is so small - it will give ammunition to those who accuse cryonics
> organisations of taking money from vulnerable people.
> Unfortunatly it honestly does not seem very likely that you will be able
> save you father but you can take pride that you tried your very best.  The
> best thing that you can do now is to think about avoiding a repeat of the
> situation you are in now. Get your mother, sister and yourself signed up
> now with an existing cryonics provider and let that be the legacy that
> father left you. Make sure that you don't lose anyone else, that you are
> ready in future.
> If I can be of any help, please let me know and I will do everything I can
> to do so. Try to be strong and know you have done all possible. Feel free
> to sign up to Cryonet to learn more and to put your views across. (I can
> give you instruction on how to do this if you like)
> I notice your surname Kostadinova, are you Russian? (I ask because my wife
> is Russian).
> Best Wishes
> Chris Benatar
> Email: 

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