X-Message-Number: 16898 Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 10:25:24 -0400 From: Thomas Donaldson <> Subject: Altruism and its possibility Hi everyone! The discussion of value causes me to comment. First of all, I doubt very much that there is any OBJECTIVE criterion for value. Yes, there are criteria which can be verified objectively, but that is not the same thing. I would also agree with Mike Peters that as we expect to live longer, our ideas about the worth of other human beings to us will make them worth much more than now ... not because of any objective value but simply because a short term approach will become less and less interesting. And if we look at someone long term, expecting that someday we'll interact with them again, then we become more valuable to one another. I was very affected by study of modern Darwinism, which looks at all the different versions of "altruism", and points out that human beings can have versions much more respectful of other beings than others, not because that respect is innate but because we take a long term approach even now, compared to other animals. In terms of one issue very important to us as cryonicists, that of whether or not we'll be revived (not from physics but from the willingness of others to actually revive us), I have said before and will repeat that cryonics isn't going to disappear in a few generations. There will always be conditions for which suspension (in some form, including perhaps solely in a computer) will become and remain needed if we wish to live as long as possible. I do not believe that anyone will even need to explain our revival as pure altruism: we'll be revived because we are the precursors of others in the future who will also have their own cryonic suspension for their own problems, whatever those problems will be. And incidentally, Darwinism doesn't think much of the idea that someday we'll simply become people who love everything. Ultimataly our altruism comes down to doing things to our own interest; its just that what is to our own interest can change if we think long term rather than short term. Best wishes and long long life for all, Thomas Donaldson Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=16898