X-Message-Number: 17951 Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2001 14:54:28 -0800 (PST) From: Scott Badger <> Subject: OT: Re: In Defense of Consciousness First: Let me say that I have only a layperson's understanding on this topic. Second: How many kinds of consciousness are there? (1) Block s (1991; 1993; 1994; 1995a,b) phenomenal consciousness, access consciousness, monitoring consciousness, reflective consciousness, self consciousness. (2) Rosenthal s (1986; 1993a,b; 1997; forthcoming) state consciousness, creature consciousness, transitive consciousness, introspective consciousness. (3) Armstrong s (1981) minimal consciousness, perceptual consciousness, introspective consciousness. (4) Tye s (1995) higher-order consciousness, discriminatory consciousness, responsive consciousness, phenomenal consciousness. Given that, [Dave Shipman] wrote: "The BOT senses the same natural phenomena as the cat and I, but I doubt if it is having the same experience, or indeed any experience whatsoever." That's because you're assigning values to the things you're observing and the BOT isn't (though it could probably be programmed to). You look at the the waves and your brain perhaps recalls pleasant experiences in your past associated with swiming in the ocean with your friends so you (mostly unconsciously) assign a positive valence to ocean waves. Ah, life is good ... The guy at the restaurant across the street looks out of the window at the waves and recalls how his wife drowned on a boating excursion last week. He sees the same waves you're seeing but for him, life sucks ... I thought before that you were saying that being aware of the environment was being conscious, but it now sounds like you're more precisely saying that appreciating the environment is what makes one conscious ... that consciousness is the ability to construct or develop positive and negative attitudes toward objects in the environment. But going back to my earlier statements, wouldn't an AI who sets goals have to assign values to certain objects in it's environment in order to achieve those goals. Could we say the AI now has attitudes? That it "feels" one way about some end results while it feels differently about others? Setting a goal is, itself, a judgmental process. So what do you think? Consciousness is: 1. being aware of the environment 2. being aware that you exist apart from the environment. 3. being aware of how you feel about and relate to the environment. 4. the experience of qualia 5. some combination of the above I have much to read at: http://www.consciousness.arizona.edu/index.html Scott Badger __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Find the one for you at Yahoo! Personals http://personals.yahoo.com Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=17951