X-Message-Number: 19041 From: "George Smith" <> References: <> Subject: Re: CryoNet #19036 - #19037 Date: Sat, 11 May 2002 10:57:14 -0700 In message #19037, Mike Donahue asked "[Why] is it that these visionary people chose to NOT to take that leap into possibility?" (referring to the possibility of informed, intelligent people signing up for cryonics). Most highly intelligent, creative people pride themselves on being "independent thinkers", that they "make up their own minds" and that they "do what makes sense". Then they make exactly the same decisions and choices as the vast majority of the people in their culture. Like preprogrammed machines. Peer pressure, fitting in with the group, bowing to social pressure - these psychological forces are insideous and all pervading. A truly excellent book on this issue is entitled "The Lucifer Principle" by Harold Bloom and is, essentially, a history of these biological forces from one celled creatures through to our species. Look at how powerful this effect is even amongst those who have dedicated decades of personal effort to support the establishment, research and growth of cryonics. I will see great concern over whether this or that statement will meet with approval or derision from "the scientific community" or "medical researchers". ... All of whom will almost certainly die and not be there when most of us are revived. Rationalizations aside, who cares? "Let the dead bury their dead." Those of us who have discussed "selling" cryonics to swell our numbers are reminded that one critical factor is social acceptance. When a certain critical mass is achieved, cryonics will undoubtedly become popular. And the reason for this is because the unconscious pressure to seek social approval is currently the number one greatest threat to our personal survival. Every single person who is currently signed up for cryonics had to choose to do so against the pressures of social conformity. Someone noted we have a higher percentage of gays, medical doctors and men than one would expect to find in a random sampling of the population. I would submit that all three of these groups have tendencies away from social acceptance which are part of their grouping. Gays are clearly acting in defiance of social pressures from the culture as a whole. Medical doctors, at least until most recently, enjoyed a position of priestcraft and power which set them apart from the rest of the culture. Even just being a man places you in a cultural structure in which you are expected to be more independent than women (though this is to some extent at least being challenged if not changing). Man is not conscious, only capable of it. Human beings believe a lot of nonsense regarding their capabilities and nature. One of these myths is that they are independent thinkers when, in fact, most so-called "thinking" is entirely unconscious in nature with only the most occasional flash of conscious awareness. Nothing makes this more obvious that the incredibly simple choice between cryonics and death. The same person who would not hesitate to be certain his health insurance covered major surgery and possible organ transplants will never seriously consider cryonics for himself. As if they were not programmed to consider this action. Robert Heinlien is dead. Isaac Asimov is dead. How many thousands of informed medical researchers and scientists and science fiction writers died already this year alone? Stupidity is an inadequate word to use to describe this insane and unnecessary carnage. But understanding that almost all people have no more free will than ants in an anthill will begin to reveal the truth behind the cultural myths. And here is the really most curious fact of all. If just ONCE you are told about these facts you can wake up YOURSELF and then exert a free will and conscious choice. The odds are against it. But you have the possibility to become conscious and do something for yourself. Or not. Just my opinion, George Smith CI member and Immortalist Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=19041