X-Message-Number: 19924
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 08:44:29 -0400
From: Thomas Donaldson <>
Subject: CryoNet #19909 - #19922

Hi Bob:

What about perpetual motion? Yes, we abandoned it because we came
to realize that energy could not be produced from nothing at all.
But before we recognized (we collectively) the conservation laws,
to look for some means of making energy from nothing was entirely

When you say that something is "totally abandoned" you also raise
questions. It's now commonly accepted that perpetual motion is
impossible (as a means of producing energy). Yet some people still
want to work on it. Furthermore, others are constantly trying to
find ways to get energy by putting in less energy than we take
out --- nuclear or fusion energy would provide an excellent case.
This is not the same as perpetual motion, but its basic aim, to
minimize the amount of work/energy/matter/etc put out to get 
energy in return, remains one that many people work on. The aim
was modified when we understood conservation laws, but in one way
never abandoned. So what is meant by "totally abandoned"?

		Best wishes and long long life,

			Thomas Donaldson

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