X-Message-Number: 20283 From: Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 09:50:16 EDT Subject: Re: CryoNet #20276 Letter to New Scientist --part1_3f.132b1ceb.2ad83118_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: From Ralph Scurlock in a John deRivaz message: > > The difference between successful cryopreservation and failure lies with > size and achievable cooling rates. A single cell survives freezing if it > cools so last that the entire cell freezes at once. Such cooling must take > place at around 1000C per minute, even when using cryoprotectants. > > If cooling takes place more slowly, the water in the cell freezes first and > the consequent rise in concentration of dissolved substances within the > cell > kills it, with no hope of later revival. Only thin sheets of human tissue, > and single cells, can be cooled fast. enough. > I agree with the above statements, it would be foolish to discard them. My conclusions are somewhat different from the ones of Mr. Ralph Scurlock: 1/ For current cryonics, I think the only way out is using uploading with a molecular brain reader. I have said that many times and I don't add more here. 2/ I think we have the think about a second generation cryonics: Antifreezes are too far away from the aim to give a safe road to full body cryopreservation. There are two options: 2a/ A classical one using antifreeze, clay protection inside the cell, ATP, heat shock protein complexes,... 2b/ An advanced supercooling process similar to the Ulam thermonuclear setup where out of thermodynamics equilibrium compression allows to cool nuclear spins in nanoseconds. Here, the thermal sink could be some form of the zero point energy of vacuum, for example a non-separable Hilbert's space. It could be built as a mathematical ring above an additive group defined on a (classical separable) Hilbert's quantum space. Such a "seed" structure would look fractal in some range, pumping energy in it could exploit Regge's trajectory and produce a large principal quantum number object with macroscopic extension. I understand that such concepts are somewhat contrived and well outside biologist minds. The technology may be deceptively simple yet, down to amateur level !(Think of that: it would freeze nuclear spins too and produce a garage grade thermonuclear device :-). Yvan Bozzonetti. --part1_3f.132b1ceb.2ad83118_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" [ AUTOMATICALLY SKIPPING HTML ENCODING! ] Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=20283