X-Message-Number: 22882
Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 16:10:05 +0100
From: Eugen Leitl <>
Subject: [Cryonics Europe] Thanks (fwd from )

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Highly sensible suggestions, imo.

----- Forwarded message from Jappie Hoekstra <> -----

From: "Jappie Hoekstra" <>
Date: Wednesday, 19 Nov 2003 15:37:00 +100
To: itsarockingworld <>
Subject: [Cryonics Europe] Thanks
X-Mailer: Internet Rex gateway (2.29)


 [*] 19 Nov 03 09:33, quoting itsarockingworld:

 i> I've been given one very good insurance quote (for a ?30,000 payout),
 i> but was wondering whether there is a company you all use who are
 i> sympathetic to our frozen ways? And is ?30,000 enough?

Depends on how long you plan to keep the insurance.. If it's only for 10 years 
it might just be enough. Inflation makes prices rise, the CI's $28,000 will one 
day be forced to increase for example. In 20 years, CI will be forced to ask 
something between $40,000 and $60,000 for the same service (if you assume they 
calculate with a 2%+ inflation each year).. Inflation also works the other way 
around, which is something most people forget. When you pay $40/month for life 
insurance then that might be a lot today; it will be close to nothing in 50 

Assuming a 3% inflation each year, CI will charge $70,000 for it's suspensions 
in ~31 years from now.. So even if you take a $100,000 life insurance now, it 
will be useless in ~40 years. And I estimate you won't die before you're 60, do 
you? Taking a very very long insurance is not always the best to do..

Another mistake easily made is taking life insurance just because you're young. 
Monthly premiums are low when you're young, yes.. But calculated over an entire 
lifetime you pretty much pay the same total amount, whether you start at age 20 
or age 50.. The premiums are just spread out over more years, so they're lower. 
If you're 99% sure you won't die in the next 20 years, you're better off 
investing it (wisely!) in the stockmarket (not now!;). That way you'll be a 
millionair around your 60th. OK, this requires a lot of gambling which is 
something cryonicists don't like. Even though cryonics is a gamble in itself.

Some insurance companies offer lifetime insurance where you also need to pay for
it your entire life. NEVER take an insurance like that! You don't know how long
you'll live.. You might die at 70, you might also die at 140 (even without 
nanotechnology!).. If you really want lifetime insurance, make sure you don't 
have to pay premiums after your 70th or 80th. It will get very expensive 

Another issue.. Illness. Most insurance companies don't want you when you're 
suffering from some kind of disease. Some companies offer you 5-year-period 
insurance with a static premium ("You can decide every 5 years if you want to 
continue with your insurance! We will then recalculate the premiumrate!").. 
Let's assume you take a very cheap 5-year insurance, and then get to suffer from
cancer or a heart disease just before the 5-year period is over.. Heh, you do 
the math. Either they don't want you anymore or your premium will double.

Two good things to remember:

.- Whatever great new type of life-insurance you see, it was invented to make 
profit and minimize risks for the insurance company. Try to find the downsides.

.- Your money is worth LOTS more on the stockmarket; but only if you know what 
you're doing. I think you can ask John the Rivaz for information on this.

Whether or not you want lifeinsurance (and for how long) depends on your 
personal taste and situation. If you feel weak or whatever, or you're a big fat 
guy who's getting fatter every day, by all means take a good lifetime insurance 
cause you might not live to become over 70 years old. In all other cases, 
there's zillions of possibilities.

Now the last issue.. You were asking whether there's an insurancecompany who's 
got sympathy for cryonicists. /They don't care/. We're not some special people 
to them, we're just clients.. Just make sure you pick a wellknown big insurance 
company and read their conditions. If there's nothing anti-cryonics in there, 
then they don't care and -by law- they need to pay when you die.. They are (at 
least on managementlevel) familiar with the concept of cryonics, plastination, 
etc.. For them it doesn't matter what one does with his/her body after death, as
long as one pays the premiums.

Good luck.

BTW, taking a lifetime membership with the CI is a good choice right now because
the US dollar is very weak right now (it reached it's all-time recorddepth 
yesterday, at least compared to the Euro).. So if you have the money and you're 
certain that the CI is the right investment, pay it soon. This saves you a lot 
of money in the long run, and gives you a good feeling in addition.

 Jappie Hoekstra

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-- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a>
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-- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a>
ICBM: 48.07078, 11.61144            http://www.leitl.org
8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A  7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE
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