X-Message-Number: 22892
From: "Graham Hipkiss" <>
References: <>
Subject: Re: CryoNet #22882 - #22890
Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 16:18:23 -0000

> Message #22882
> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 16:10:05 +0100
> From: Eugen Leitl <>
> Subject: [Cryonics Europe] Thanks (fwd from )
> Highly sensible suggestions, imo.

            Except for the following:-

            1)  Delaying Life Assurance is not a gamble cryonicists should
take. If you cannot afford to prepay take out Life Assurance now, whatever
your age.

            2)  It is advisable to obtain a policy which has an indexed
linked option.  This allows you to increase the sum assured every year in
line with inflation.  There are now policies (in the UK anyway) which allow
you to choose to increase anytime, you do not have to increase every year.

            3)  Universal type policies can be arranged with a low premium
which are reviewed every 5/10 years, which would not be recommended for
cryonics as they become unpayable in old age.  However, the same policies
can be set up on a 'lifetime' or 'standard' basis (at a higher premium
obviously)which are designed to maintain a level premium throughout life.

            4)  Once a policy is taken out premiums do not increase with ill
health. Even the policies that are reviewed, only your current age and the
current value of funds alocated to that policy are considered.

            5)  Do it yourself investment can be beneficial, but a cheap
term assurance should be taken out as cover while the fund is growing and
then a policy should be chosen that has a convertible option so that change
to a whole of life policy (regardles of health) is available if things don't
work out as planned.

            Perhaps Rudi Hoffman can comment if the above is not in line
with US Life Assurance or if I have missed anything obvious.


> ----- Forwarded message from Jappie Hoekstra
<> -----
> From: "Jappie Hoekstra" <>
> Date: Wednesday, 19 Nov 2003 15:37:00 +100
> To: itsarockingworld <>
> Subject: [Cryonics Europe] Thanks
> X-Mailer: Internet Rex gateway (2.29)
> Reply-To: 
>  Hey,
>  [*] 19 Nov 03 09:33, quoting itsarockingworld:
>  i> I've been given one very good insurance quote (for a ?30,000 payout),
>  i> but was wondering whether there is a company you all use who are
>  i> sympathetic to our frozen ways? And is ?30,000 enough?
> Depends on how long you plan to keep the insurance.. If it's only for 10
years it might just be enough. Inflation makes prices rise, the CI's $28,000
will one day be forced to increase for example. In 20 years, CI will be
forced to ask something between $40,000 and $60,000 for the same service (if
you assume they calculate with a 2%+ inflation each year).. Inflation also
works the other way around, which is something most people forget. When you
pay $40/month for life insurance then that might be a lot today; it will be
close to nothing in 50 years.
> Assuming a 3% inflation each year, CI will charge $70,000 for it's
suspensions in ~31 years from now.. So even if you take a $100,000 life
insurance now, it will be useless in ~40 years. And I estimate you won't die
before you're 60, do you? Taking a very very long insurance is not always
the best to do..
> Another mistake easily made is taking life insurance just because you're
young. Monthly premiums are low when you're young, yes.. But calculated over
an entire lifetime you pretty much pay the same total amount, whether you
start at age 20 or age 50.. The premiums are just spread out over more
years, so they're lower. If you're 99% sure you won't die in the next 20
years, you're better off investing it (wisely!) in the stockmarket (not
now!;). That way you'll be a millionair around your 60th. OK, this requires
a lot of gambling which is something cryonicists don't like. Even though
cryonics is a gamble in itself.
> Some insurance companies offer lifetime insurance where you also need to
pay for it your entire life. NEVER take an insurance like that! You don't
know how long you'll live.. You might die at 70, you might also die at 140
(even without nanotechnology!).. If you really want lifetime insurance, make
sure you don't have to pay premiums after your 70th or 80th. It will get
very expensive otherwise.
> Another issue.. Illness. Most insurance companies don't want you when
you're suffering from some kind of disease. Some companies offer you
5-year-period insurance with a static premium ("You can decide every 5 years
if you want to continue with your insurance! We will then recalculate the
premiumrate!").. Let's assume you take a very cheap 5-year insurance, and
then get to suffer from cancer or a heart disease just before the 5-year
period is over.. Heh, you do the math. Either they don't want you anymore or
your premium will double.
> Two good things to remember:
> .- Whatever great new type of life-insurance you see, it was invented to
make profit and minimize risks for the insurance company. Try to find the
> .- Your money is worth LOTS more on the stockmarket; but only if you know
what you're doing. I think you can ask John the Rivaz for information on
> Whether or not you want lifeinsurance (and for how long) depends on your
personal taste and situation. If you feel weak or whatever, or you're a big
fat guy who's getting fatter every day, by all means take a good lifetime
insurance cause you might not live to become over 70 years old. In all other
cases, there's zillions of possibilities.
> Now the last issue.. You were asking whether there's an insurancecompany
who's got sympathy for cryonicists. /They don't care/. We're not some
special people to them, we're just clients.. Just make sure you pick a
wellknown big insurance company and read their conditions. If there's
nothing anti-cryonics in there, then they don't care and -by law- they need
to pay when you die.. They are (at least on managementlevel) familiar with
the concept of cryonics, plastination, etc.. For them it doesn't matter what
one does with his/her body after death, as long as one pays the premiums.
> Good luck.
> BTW, taking a lifetime membership with the CI is a good choice right now
because the US dollar is very weak right now (it reached it's all-time
recorddepth yesterday, at least compared to the Euro).. So if you have the
money and you're certain that the CI is the right investment, pay it soon.
This saves you a lot of money in the long run, and gives you a good feeling
in addition.
> -- 
>  Jappie Hoekstra
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