X-Message-Number: 24267 Date: Fri, 18 Jun 2004 10:06:45 -0400 From: Thomas Donaldson <> Subject: CryoNet #24261 - #24266 HI everyone! The most substantive comment about G. Urban's message is that all those needles are likely to be quite unnecessary if we work towards a good vitrification. Current suspension methods already work toward complete coverage of a patient's brain. When (now years ago, unfortunate- ly) some cryonics societies were using animals (dogs) to test their methods, the dog brains clearly got a complete perfusion. There is certainly a case for similar tests with current solutions, which have changed a good deal from those early ones, but it is the character of the solution rather than any other factors which allows it to spread through a patient's brain. Even if the solution is designed to vitrify at some low temperature, before it does so it will spread easily through a patient's brain. And the time required for it to do this need not be a few seconds; at the low temperatures used, even above but near 0 C, a brain will last long enough without deterioration for the solution to spread out inside it. As for verification of this point, it would be a useful experiment for a cryonics lab to once more use some of the most recent solutions (aimed at vitrification rather than freezing) to verify these points on dogs. I doubt, however, that they'll be proven false. Best wishes and long long life to all, Thomas Donaldson Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=24267