X-Message-Number: 25273 From: "Valera Retyunin" <> Subject: Intrusion into Scott-Richard's dialogue Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 19:04:54 +0300 Scott: So we finally agree on something. The human mind CAN BE sustained on a non-biological substrate with the original QE. Valera: Strictly speaking, there's only a POSSIBILITY that human mind can be sustained on a non-biological substrate. Scott: So if the instantaneous replacement of all your neurons with artificial duplicates destroys the QE, just how quickly can I replace them if I do so one at a time (assuming there was no limitation to how quickly I could replace them)? Just a fraction of a second short of instantaneous? Valera: Slowly enough so that the QE does not stop existing at any point during the process. Scott: Now let s say the external system I choose to build and expand into is a replica of the brain system inside of my skull so that my internal system gets connected to an identical external system. Being identical to my internal system, the external system also has the structures necessary to experience qualia and begins doing so as soon as I expand into it. So the two systems have become one system, and qualia are happening to both of my QE s, both of which would be having the same internal subjective experience. Valera: First, you cannot have two QEs because YOU are your QE (it's just another word for YOU). Second, I wouldn't recommend expanding your brain in such a way. Your external brain system would already have its own QE. Who knows what would happen? A peaceful merger of two DIFFERENT QEs into a third QE, or sci-fi schizophrenia? And would you really like merging into a new QE? You cannot know what it's like. YOU may well die in the merger. So if you truly want to EXPAND your brain, you'd better add any extensions piece by piece. Scott: So now I have a redundant brain system and the accidental or intentional loss of either QE structures would not result in the destruction of the original QE since the overall physical system remains capable of experiencing qualia and continuity would be maintained. Valera: I think that, in principle, you may be able to extend your brain to the extent that you can survive losing all of the "old" brain structures. But since abrupt loss of any significant part of the extended brain would be, at the very least, a serious brain trauma, you'd better "switch off" unnecessary brain structures gradually. Scott: Have I broken any of your theory s rules yet? If not, haven t I just uploaded without losing my original QE? Valera: It depends on what you mean by uploading. As I understand it, you have not uploaded but upgraded yourself. And finally regarding the Gazzaniga's theory: Whether I am an active doer or a passive observer of the doings of my subconsciousness, I still place the highest value on the "thin veneer of consciousness" which you seem to suggest we should "shed". I am my consciousness. If it's just a passive watcher, then the first thing I want to preserve is the passive watcher. Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=25273