X-Message-Number: 27033
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 11:06:42 -0400
From: Thomas Donaldson <>
Subject: To Peter M and David S

To Peter Merel (and David Stodolsky if he's listening):

First, about rationality. Rationality (in my terms) is never foolish. It
can be mistaken, but that's not the same. 

I'm happy with being nice to others, as you might have realized from
my message. The problem is what to do with those who don't return the
favor. If I can simply avoid them, that's fine; but I may have to 
deal with such people more directly. I do not believe that you would
continue to be nice to someone who steals your identity and most
of your financial property. When I spoke of social games, I perhaps
should have made clear that they're attempts to model real human
behavior, as distinct from the "moral behavior" we hear about all
the time. Unfortunately "moral behavior" just doesn't work.

Nor were the ends of wars pictures of happiness by all parties. In
WW II, particularly, the victors dragged away the commanders of
the losers, gave them show trials, and killed them. This conduct
was much like that in other such wars, perhaps excepting the show
trials (in other wars those commanders either got ransomed, or 
got killed, with no special international legal niceties). Nor
was Germany given equal standing until another set of enemies
came along and the assistance at least of West Germany was needed.

Finally, if you don't like such behavior, it's rational to look
at just what produces it. Among other important things, I personally
think that immortality or anything close to immortality would
change such behavior --- by BOTH parties. It's not a good idea
not to be reasonably nice to someone whom you will see many
times for the next 10,000 years.

For David, I still haven't got any references from you, nor
for that matter any arguments. It's easy enough to use various
principles to criticise one behavior or another. The problem
is not how to criticise, but how to work out what to really
do.

          Best wishes and long long life for all,

              Thomas Donaldson

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