X-Message-Number: 30256
Subject: Re: Alcor: "Greatest idea yet known to mankind"
Date: Sat, 05 Jan 2008 20:20:34 -0500
From:
----------MB_8CA1E19784FE576_14F4_21EE_mblk-d15.sysops.aol.com
It is prudent under emploment law to keep certain information re employees
confidential to avoid liabilities or where Alcor has signed confidentiality
agreements or in the instance of ongoing litigation where premature disclosure
could be very damaging. That is probably what Steve VS is referring to
Dave....not hiding mistakes. I have been on the board for many years and am not
aware of the board hiding anything with the exception of the above. You know
philosophically and logically Dave that it is impossible to prove a negative
so I cannot prove that mistakes were not hidden. Can you give me evidence
indicating where Alcor has hidden mistakes from its members for me to consider?
Michael Riskin
-----Original Message-----
From: david pizer <>
To:
Cc: david pizer <>; RUSSEL CHENEY <>; Mike
Perry <>; AlcorAdvisors <>; Mike Darwin
<>; Aschwin de Wolf <>; Alcor Directors
<>; Greg <>; Tanya Jones <>;
Steve <>; Cryonet <>; Bill
<>; JenniferChapman <>
Sent: Sat, 5 Jan 2008 4:28 pm
Subject: Re: Alcor: "Greatest idea yet known to mankind"
I would like to point out differences in the two
ifferent systems for managing Alcor that are being
ebated.
Some of us are arguing for a system where the
irectors are elected by the members, and therefore
eld accountable for their actions. We say this
ystem is the best way to prevent mistakes in a
ompany because it causes an evolution of directors,
he fittest (best qualified to make decisions for
lcor) survive and get re-elected. The ones that
upported policy that caused mistakes get replaced.
We say that by allowing the best possible leaders to
volve into the management of Alcor will be the best
ay to avoid mistakes and if Alcor doesn't make
istakes they don't get sued, etc. (Steve talks about
etting sued in his original message).
The existing directors seem to favor just re-electing
hemselves over and over regardless of their record of
istakes and they have a different plan for keeping
rom getting sued. And that plan is NOT necessarily to
uit making mistakes. Here is what director and Alcor
resident Steve VanSickle thinks we can do to avoid
etting sued for any mistakes he may be responsible
or.
Steve VanSickle said:
And on those occasions when it *does* get dramatic,
sually the legally prudent thing to do is not make
atters worse by flapping your mouth, unless you
eally *like* getting sued."
Translated that means that VanSickle is more concerned
ith hiding mistakes then avoiding them. Rather then
dvocate for a system that causes better managers to
volve, he says we can just clam up, not tell anyone
bout the mistakes we make. And that is what the
lcor board has been doing the last 7 or 8 years. If
ou read Steve's whole post below, he remembers the
ld days when Alcor was open and honest with it's
embers, and when growth was much better and member
articipation and support was much better then it is
ow under his control of Alcor. And he is willing to
rade all that off for a policy of secrecy.
Now if you are an Alcor member, how are you going to
now if Alcor is really in big trouble when the board
as this policy of not telling the members about the
eally big problems?
The answer is we won't know. The board says we can't
ote, and we should just trust them, and now they say
e can't know the problems and we should just trust
hem. And what are Alcor members saying to the board
ow-a-days?
A lot of them seem to be saying "Goodby!" In the last
wo years, for every net gain of 1 member, 1 member
as left Alcor. That tells us that people like the
deas that Alcor stands for, prospect of immortality,
r radical extension of life attempt.
he board has been using the threat of getting sued as
reason for holding secret meetings and keeping
nformation about the mistakes they have made for the
ast 7 or 8 years. They use things like the current
rouble Alcor is in, the risks to Alcor at any one
ime, as a reason to not tell us. But I think another
eason they want to keep things secret is they don't
ant us members to know just how bad they are really
oing. They don't want us to know all the mistakes
heir leadership has caused.
I say a better way to protect Alcor is to do things
ight in the first place. To quit making mistakes.
he way to make that happen is to make the leaders who
re responsible for what happens be held accountable
or the results, and if those results are bad don't
ide them from us, allow us to replace the guys who
ake them. That's what honest, successful well-run
usinesses try to do.
We are the most honest, moral and ethical organization
in our goals) in the world. We don't have to hide
hat we do. We should be making our goals and ideas
nown to all mankind, not hiding our dailey actions.
n the old days we did make our everyday actions
ublic and we grew faster.
For example, some thought the Dora Kent affair was
oing to destroy us. They wanted us to hide
verthing. We told the world what we did and why. By
oing public with our side of it, instead of being a
isaster we turned it into one of the best
und-raising and membership raising events in our
istory.
Only when we return to a policy of accountability of
ur leaders and more honesty with our members will
lcor have a chance of starting meaningful growth
gain.
lack of growth in membership is the single biggest
hreat to our patients. It is what contributed to the
emise of all those failed cryonics organizations so
ar.
--- wrote:
> Brian wrote:
> I remember those days well. They were days
a large percentage
> of Alcor members were activists, and drove growth
with regular
> meetings and outreach to like-minded associates.
They were days when
> Cryonics magazine chronicled organizational ups
*and* downs in such
> detail that waiting for the next monthly issue was
like waiting for
> the next installment in a story. They were days
of 30% year over year
> growth, sustained for several years.
I remember the glory days, too. The freewheeling
drama of an ongoing soap
opera, waiting in my mailbox. I was addicted to the
story, too, month
after month. Not just the dry technical details,
but the acrimony, the
employee problems splashed out for everyone to see
regardless of legal
risk, the arrests and legal fights for our very
existence, the macabre
stories and personal rants in our magazine and
online...yes, all that was
very exciting.
How many hospitals have monthly newsletters,
spelling out in detail the
fights among the hospital board, and how they just
got this great deal on
surgical equipment for scrap prices...just buff it a
little an no one will
know!? How many relate the said demise of Cuddles,
the Unbearably Cute
Puppy who gave his life for the good of the hospital
(next time, we'll get
it right!)? How many continually have to tell all
about the efforts of
the state to shut it down because they scare the
hell out of people? Not
many, because a well run hospital (or any company)
is boring. I, and you
too, should aspire to boring. We aren't quite there
yet, but we are a lot
closer than we have been in a while, and I hope we
get even more boring.
Drama is all well and good for romantic hobbyists
out pushing the limits
of the possible, all wrapped up in a cult of
personality, but it is not
the way professionals do things. Adrenaline junkies
need to look
elsewhere for their fixes.
This is not to say that openness is a bad thing, or
that we shouldn't talk
about problems, but most of the time that isn't very
dramatic either. And
on those occasions when it *does* get dramatic,
usually the legally
prudent thing to do is not make matters worse by
flapping your mouth,
unless you really *like* getting sued.
So, if anyone can think of a way to get that old
excitement without the
problems that went with it, I'm all ears. But do
please remember that
the good old days are never as good as we
remember.
steve vs
____________________________________________________________________________________
ever miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
ttp://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
________________________________________________________________________
More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! -
http://webmail.aol.com
----------MB_8CA1E19784FE576_14F4_21EE_mblk-d15.sysops.aol.com
Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"
[ AUTOMATICALLY SKIPPING HTML ENCODING! ]
Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=30256