X-Message-Number: 32507 Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 18:16:34 +0100 (CET) From: Subject: Re: Down with Uploading References: <> Atoms (A and B) at minimum are at different locations, hence are distinguishable. That's the minimum in atomic differences for some individuals who are likely to adapt to the standards of middle class people signing up and making money for cryonics without greater hurdles. Many viable atoms in their brains will be the same during cryosuspension. The atoms from their brains will be traceable in distances to each other. Generally, most people don't sign up for cryonics. They are not getting enough money, ateist (or benevolent religious) relatives, close family members who are supportive to cryonics, and other benefits which make it easy to get into a contract with a cryonics provider. Thus, they are lacking enough of the incentives to get away with a selfish arrangement for life extension which doesn't work for other family members or supporters. Atoms in most of brains will end up in the soil below the ground. Mind Uploading doesn't help them and the locations of hydrogen atoms A and B from their brains are becoming untraceable on Earth. Thus, they cannot be distinguished from each other by any other criterion than statistics or rule of thumb. According to Leibniz and without guessing, the atoms will be considered the same. The question is, what uploading can be appropriate for them? A recommendable procedure for those who don't make it into suspension of their brains could be Beme Uploading with mindfiles almost exclusively supported by Terasem. Of cause, locations of hydrogen atoms A and B can still be estimated the distance from the nearest to the most remote grave for corporal remains. Yet we see a chance in the wideness of the solar system where that distance must be greater. So I'd be happy to become a robot on the moon to continue with my forefathers', a Scientific Librarian and the other an Engineering Physicist. > Message #32503 (*shortened*) > From: > Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:12:05 EDT > Subject: Down with Uploading > > The relevance of this to cryonics is marginal but not zero. It is > political or PR-related. > I think there is a small but not insignificant group who think that, since > > quite a few > cryonicists are also Uploaders, they are tarred with the same brush. > This was instigated by my recent second looks at some works by uploaders, > > including > Perry, Tipler, Moravec, and Kurzweil. ...cut... > First, this assertion actually asserts nothing except a certain preference > > in > use of language. It has no consequences. It is also useless because if > the > question arises, are A and B distinguishable, the answer is always yes. An > > > example might be two hydrogen atoms, which some would say fill the > bill. But the atoms at minimum are at different locations, hence are > distinguishable, e.g. by a mass detector of appropriate sensitivity. In > addition, being at different locations, they necessarily differ in other > ways too, such as the gravitational fields to which they are subjected. ...cut... // Holt sich Schumi den 8. Titel seiner Formel-1-Karriere? Schumi reloaded, alle Infos, Fahrer- und Team-Portraits und das Formel-1-Experten-Quiz finden Sie hier: http://www.arcor.de/rd/footer.f1 Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=32507