X-Message-Number: 3842
From:  (Thomas Donaldson)
Subject: Re: CryoNet #3816 - #3820
Date: Mon, 13 Feb 1995 17:09:56 -0800 (PST)



Re UPLOADING:

A remarkably opaque discussion.

It may be true that intelligence is what distinguishes us from animals, but
that does not imply that we wish to upload or preserve only the information-
processing (those responsible for our intelligence) parts of our brain. WE
are animals, and our feelings have great value for us. To be uploaded without
them is just an elaborate version of death.

(The discussion of intelligence also begs many questions, the first of which
is a definition. We have indeed acquired various mental abilities (no doubt
because of our brain structure and size). As we learn more about how brains
fit together, we will come to realize that other animals have other mental
abilities. For instance, some birds show a truly vast memory for the exact
location of seeds they have stored away. It would be nice to specify the
abilities which make up "intelligence" in a noncircular way ie. by referring
to our brain structure).

Nor does it follow that because our "selves" consist of information processing
modules that uploading will necessarily be easy or possible at all in any
practical sense. It does us no good, for instance, to be uploaded into a 
computer which (theoretically) reproduces our reactions perfectly, but 10 
times more slowly. One insight coming from parallel computing is that a
simple discussion of Turing machines simply isn't enough for practical
purposes: time matters. A second insight is that the architecture of the
computer can play a large part in how efficiently it performs the required
information processing: a parallel computer designed for signal processing
can be USED for other jobs, but will not be as competitive as one designed
more for that particular job. As in most things, of course, when we buy or
make computers we try to reach an optimum: not TOO restricted, but then 
still capable of doing what we want at a reasonable rate.

But this leaves open a major question about uploading: WE DON'T YET KNOW
AT ALL THAT ANY OTHER COMPUTER STRUCTURE THAN THAT OF OUR BRAIN WILL 
REALLY PERFORM OPTIMALLY in running us. That is the real issue for discussion
when a question about whether uploading is possible at all is raised.
The mere observation that we do information processing means virtually 
nothing as an answer to this question.

I personally, in considering our biology, suspect (but would not hold to
it as an axiom) that our present processing speed is the result of an 
optimization rather than a result of the fact that we are made of biological
materials. Rhodopsin, the visual pigment, reacts so fast to light that 
it is under study for use in computers. Neurons pass electrical signals,
but they also pass signals of other kinds (a very interesting fact!). If
electrical circuits were so good for all the purposes we need them for in
our own design, why then do we also have these OTHER means of transmitting
signals? One would think that they would have become obsolete (ie. evolved
away) long ago. For those who insist on arguing about this, please note
my introduction to this paragraph. For that matter, we can be optimal for
our present situation but not for other future ones.

				Long long life,

					Thomas Donaldson



Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=3842