X-Message-Number: 5078
From:  (Thomas Donaldson)
Subject: Re: CryoNet #5067 - #5069
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 1995 10:46:14 -0800 (PST)

Hi again!

About frogs: I can't answer about that particular species, but cryobiologists
have looked at such animals with that in mind. Unfortunately, those that have
been studied, even though they DID naturally make cryoprotectants in the blood,
did not make ones good enough to preserve the animals at -196 C (LN temp).

About governments: here's another way to look at it. We all have our own 
private property. But there are many other things in the world that (for
one reason or another) cannot in practise become the private property of 
anyone. While there may be other reasons (desire to dominate others, etc) why
a government might form, controlling such things (say, the atmosphere on the
planet Earth) is one rational reason why governments can form. (It is NOT a
natural state of mankind ... hunter-gatherer cultures are anarchistic, though
they do have property and even dominance within small groups. And human beings
have lived as members of such groups for far longer than they've lived in 
states of any kind).

And about this process, two points need making:

First, the list of objects (in the broad sense) that can be private property
depends both on social norms and on technology too. We invented such things as
copyright, for instance; to enforce copyright, various technologies were also
needed. Corollary: that list changes with time.

Two, once such governments form, they will tend to attract particular 
personalities to manage them: those who want to impose themselves on others.
They will also tend to grow... partly for that reason, and partly for the
simple reason that even if the manager is NOT a domineering person looking out
for power, like anyone else he wants more goods, influence, etc.

I don't have the citation, but apparently among those who seriously study 
such things, someone has proven that we could handle all the tasks of govern-
ment simply by assigning EVERYTHING as private property ie. you own the air,
I own the ocean and water, some others own land plots of various sizes, etc.
The parties would then work out some kind of agreement, buying and selling,
between them. (This is, as you can guess, a totally theoretical assumption).

However the argument does fall down if change of any kind enters the picture.
If I invent a NEW kind of good, just who is to own it? If something happens 
to decrease the supply of water (say) then what is the response? For that 
matter, if my new good requires materials which were common and widespread,
and formerly thought worthless, what ownership arrangements shall we make.

Many of the problems governments claim to cure are also problems they had
a large hand in causing: poverty in the US is a prime example. Of course,
once the problem exists, it may very well require MORE government (of some
kind). The campaigns to criminalize drug use (by which, thankfully, I do
not now mean antiaging drugs!) of course create criminals, who then must be
dealt with by police, who are tools of governments... etc.

Do I have any solution for this fundamental problem? Sorry, other than that
we try to keep a watch on our various governments, I do not.

		Best and long long life,

			Thomas Donaldson


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