X-Message-Number: 628 Subject: CRYONICS response to Whitaker From: (Edgar W. Swank) Date: Sun, 02 Feb 92 12:18:46 PST With the departure of Mike Darwin from ALCOR leadership, I and others in ACS and Trans-Time hoped we might see an improvement in relations between us and ALCOR. However, I must respond to the attack, unprovoked as far as we are aware, of Mr. Russell E. Whitaker of Alcor UK in Cryonet Message #618. The initial subject was a report by Hank Lederer in message 616 of a report that "Muhammad Ali is going to sign up with ACS..". First, I want to commend the very polite response posted by Thomas Donaldson in message 617. I find no fault with it at all. But consider Mr. Whitaker's message. He starts out: This is offensive. *If* this were true, why would any cryonics organization which respected its members - or potential members - _ever_ make such a statement? I would never have involved myself in cryonics, had an _Alcor_ officer made such a statement. Did Ben-Abraham have Ali's permission to make this assertion? Well, Mr. Whitaker, Alcor officers *have* made such statements, for example, from the Extropians mailing list: From: szebra!cup.portal.com!hkhenson To: gnu.ai.mit.edu!extropians Subject: Re: Tim Leary Date: Wed, 29 Jan 92 22:21:21 PST Re Tim Leary, extropians might be interested that he is signed up with Alcor. Keith Henson I think in both cases, people were revealing things about personal friends (Avi Ben-Abraham is a personal friend of Ali, at least). I think that it should be a matter between them and not a subject of outside criticism. By the way, Mr. Whitaker, did you have Mr. Price's permission to publish what I expect was a private remark disparaging ACS/TT: I agree with Michael Clive Price, who commented to me that ACS/Trans Time are publicity-driven, while Alcor is technology-driven. I rather doubt it since I have found Mr. Price's many submissions here and elsewhere to avoid such disparagement. Having vented his spleen about the Ali report, Mr. Whitaker now drags in unrelated subjects gratuitously: And even if this were true, and Ali had given his permission, so what? Where are the accounts of ACS research? Emergency response capability? I have news for those who don't know this: ACS/Trans Time have _no_ emergency response capability, as a matter of policy. Ask them about that, sometime. I posted a recent account about ACS research by Dr. Paul Segall in this mailing list. I also posted an account (warts and all) of the latest ACS/TT freezing. After reading your statement, Mr. Whitaker, I did ask Jim Yount and Art Quaife about our emergency response capability. We do have one and we always have. I wear a Medic-Alert bracelet just like you do. Our emergency response capabilites are naturally better in the Bay Area then elsewhere. However I'm told that TT has a complete set of supplies & equipment for a suspension all packed up and ready to fly to a remote location, including even sterile water. We continue to make improvements, adding a perfusion cart with roller pumps, oxygen, and an improved ice cooling tank. We in ACS and Trans-Time, for the record, are willing to give Alcor the benefit of the doubt and assume they are fallible but sincere and well-intentioned. We would wish you would give us the same consideration in the future. It's possible for both of us to tell what's good about our group without disparaging other groups. If you will check back in this list's archives, you will see that ACS and TT have followed that policy for a long time. On the other hand, gratuitous attacks like Mr. Whitaker's do Alcor less good than they do the Cryonics movmement in general harm, IMHO. Please, if we can't be friendly, let's at least be civil. -- (Edgar W. Swank) SPECTROX SYSTEMS (408)252-1005 Silicon Valley, Ca Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=628