X-Message-Number: 6716
From: Brian Wowk <>
Date: Thu, 8 Aug 1996 14:01:54 -0500
Subject: SCI.CRYONICS objectivity

Bob Ettinger writes:

> 2. Brian apparently roughed up Mrs. Visser through misguided
> loyalty to someone else, allowing his objectivity to lapse.

	My most harsh remarks, which Mrs. Visser took greatest
exception to, were in response to claims that she had revived
*entire rats* from liquid nitrogen.  This was subsequently
revealed to be an error in correspondence between Mrs. Visser
and Anatole Dolinoff.  I have clarified this with Mrs. Visser 
privately, and much of this misunderstanding has been cleared up.  

>Brian says he didn't realize it might be applicable to larger
>organs, because he thought it required flash freezing. But he
>knows, first, that you can't "flash" freeze anything as large as a
>rat heart; and second, even if fast freezing was involved, he had
>no way of concluding that ONLY fast freezing would work.

	Perhaps the best frozen brain histology in the world
today is obtained not by cryonics organizations, but by 
neurological research banks that slice brains into 5mm slices
and freeze the slices between metal plates at -196'C without
any cryoprotectant at all.  The faster the freezing, the smaller
the ice crystals, and direct immersion of small tissue samples
into liquid nitrogen can result in ice crystals so small that
the tissue is almost vitrified.

	Direct immersion of tissue into liquid nitrogen is a
completely different cryobiological regime than the slow
cooling large organs like the human brain require.  I look
forward to confirmation that the South African cryoprotectant
is effective at cooling rates compatible with brain preservation.

> The whole (Prometheus) project may even be outdated by other
> developments. We'll just have to see.

	Given that the goal of the Project is to convincingly
demonstrate complete neurological recovery after deep cooling 
of a brain, who is going to do that before 1998?  Even if methods
are developed, proven and published for cryopreserving every
transplantable organ in the human body within the next 18 months,
who but the Prometheus Project will do the neuroscience experiments
necessary to validate the methods on the brain?  This Project
is crucial to cryonicists not because organ cryopreservation
breakthroughs might not be forthcoming within the next 18 months,
but *especially because* organ cryopreservation breakthroughs
will be published within the next 18 months.
Brian Wowk          CryoCare Foundation               1-800-TOP-CARE
President           Human Cryopreservation Services   

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