X-Message-Number: 8097 Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 08:49:24 -0700 (MST) From: Fred Chamberlain <> Subject: CRYONICS "Immortality" Message #8088 Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:50:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Olaf Henny <> Subject: CRYONICS CryoNet #8081 (Mike Perry); #8031 (Mike C.) >Again to Olaf Henny: you say "The notion of immortality is >at this time ridiculous anyhow." I disagree, but I think I understand >where you're coming from, and I've devoted a lot of space recently >to airing my point of view, so I'll close for now. One brief comment, aside from the observation that I wish I had more time to spend even *reading* all the postings on CryoNet carefully, to say nothing of contributing to them: While the term "immortality" is a useful way of indicating an ultimate goal, it carries with it the same conceptual problems as "infinity", which points toward a totally unbounded domain. For a person to be "immortal", it must mean that they can live "forever". But in order to know if you can really pull it off, you must first achieve it. By the time the heat death of the universe comes about, if that were to be its destiny, and you had solved *that* problem, you would still only be at the very start of the challenge of "living forever". So it will be a long, long time before you know if you're "got it made". While I basically like the term "immortality", other terms are often more useful in practical discussions. Over even modest periods of time like 100,000 years, we will surely change our natures to such an extent that we will look back on the level and mode of our present existence as only a nucleus, a starting point, such as the universe would regard the "big bang" (if the universe were conscious and thus capable of such a "thought"). By the time we are even one baby step down the road toward what we presently mean by "immortality", we will have far better ways of describing our destinies. Notwithstanding that, I find it inspiring that so much discussion can arise over a term like "immortality". It is easy for us old time cryonicists to remember days when a dark cloud would come across an ordinary living room if one were to use such a mundane term as "anti-aging" or "attempted suspended animation". It's a whole new ball game now, and I'm "eternally" (another "too big" word) grateful for that! Boundless life, Fred Chamberlain Alcor Life Extension Foundation Pres/CEO Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=8097