X-Message-Number: 8165
Date: Fri, 02 May 1997 10:54:34 +0100
From: John de Rivaz <>
Subject: Re: Are we in a simulation?

In article: <>  
writes:
> First, answer me how you can prove that you are in the real world, and
> then we can go on to the question of the subjectivity experienced by a
> computerized intelligence.
> 
> I contend that last week, I anesthetized you, removed your brain from
> your body, put it on life support, and attached you to a VR
> system. Prove that I didn't. Demonstrate that I'm lying.
> 

To do that would require technology that is not available at this time nor 
is likely to be available for several decades or even more. A similar 
scenario is covered in the film "Total Recall" - surely most people on this 
list have seen it. *In the film, the characters were aware all the time that 
the technology existed*.

If Metzner had put Ettinger into a VR connected vat, the all the rest of us 
must also be part of the simulated world. It would be only a part simulation 
as the technology to do the job does not exist for us either.

Nevertheless the problem of simulations is an important one.

A possible way of reviving cryonics patients gently and keeping them sane 
would be to put them in a VR world in which the trauma of their death is 
erased and they gradually experience everything that goes between their death 
and their reanimation day. Of course this need not be in real time and 
therefore the process can be done quickly even though subjectively it could 
take decades or even centuries. This world would have a "god" which would be 
invisible and his actions would not be noticed by the subject. However the 
things that happen to the subject would be educational in alingning him to 
the future society. 

I have just got a copy of "The Fabric of Reality" by David Deutsch. The 
jacket suggests that this covers the subject of simulations in great detail. 
Maybe I and others can comment better when we have read it.

-- 
               *****************************************
Sincerely,     *          Longevity Report             *
               * http://www.longevb.demon.co.uk/lr.htm *
John de Rivaz  *           Fractal Report              *
               * http://www.longevb.demon.co.uk/fr.htm *
               *       Music I like - see homepage     *
               *****************************************
    In the information age, sharing can increase world
    wealth enormously, because giving information does
              not decrease your information.
     http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/JohndeR                        
      Fast loading, very few slow pictures

Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=8165