X-Message-Number: 8320
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 03:16:56 -0700
From: Hara Ra <>
Subject: Re: CryoNet #8237 - #8239
References: <>

> From: "Perry E. Metzger" <>

> Absent a definition, its hard to even begin reasoning about the
> property. Things which are so slippery that they have no good
> definition should arouse our suspicion.
> 
OK. Let's get some definitions going here. Get out your nits and pick
away, but the price to join the picking is to offer a definition of your
own:

-------------------------
Definition: Consciousness

A system is conscious if:

	1. It is capable of lingusitic communication (it can talk)
	2. It can discuss its own existence (it knows it exists)

-------------------------
The second condition is the tough one, of course. Let me propose a
Turing style test by saying that a human using a teletype could not
distinguish between a human (or other system presumed to be known as
conscious) and the system under test, with the discussion limited to the
topics we usually consider to be "about consciousness". If that is too
general, how about "experience of existence".

As a challenge to the deeper thinkers here, I state that a ruthless
application of the above definition combined with the following idea
leads quite logically to a reaonably good definition of "soul".

	3. All of my memories of being conscious include the memory of my
existence.

Have fun!

O---------------------------------O
|  Hara Ra <> |
|  Box 8334 Santa Cruz, CA 95061  |
O---------------------------------O

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