X-Message-Number: 8334 Date: Thu, 19 Jun 97 08:56:15 From: Mike Perry <> Subject: Consciousness Stephen Bogner, #8324, has, I think, come up with some illuminating ideas about consciousness, by which I do not mean I think his formalism is perfect--but it certainly has merits. This is the sort of material I was looking for on the Web recently by searching under "artificial consciousness"--and didn't find. (Maybe it was there but I just missed it.) Some critics will, no doubt, complain that there is nothing in Bogner's definitions that says anything about feeling, which might be claimed as a necessary accompaniment of consciousness. However, I think the issue of feeling can also be approached in a similar way, i.e. reductionistically. We should be able to come up with conditions under which a system could be said to exhibit "feeling" much as Mr. Bogner has developed for consciousness. Another possible criticism might relate to "behavior" as one of the stated requirements of consciousness. Could not a system be conscious but totally paralyzed? On the other hand, could its "behavior" be judged by internal transformations, or must we limit ourselves to exterior observables? It does seem plausible to me that a thermostat should be regarded as having a "quantum" of consciousness rather than absolutely none at all. (And I would extend this to a quantum of feeling as well. In a very rudimentary way, the thermostat "wants" to make the temperature of the room fall within a desired range.) Multiply that quantum by 10^N for N sufficiently large (15?23? bigger?) and it does seem as if human-level consciousness and beyond could result. I also think his last point (as I understand it) is well taken, that theoretically uploading human consciousness into a machine should be possible but it may well be impractical because of the complexity involved. On the other hand, machines of the future should be much more powerful than those of today (and could involve such novelties as quantum computing, which could make them much more powerful still)--so we'll see. Mike Perry Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=8334