X-Message-Number: 9239
From: Thomas Donaldson <>
Subject: Re: CryoNet #9234 - #9237
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 1998 22:38:22 -0800 (PST)

Hi again!

To Bob:

Actually I have considered feeling, and think it very important, though I do
not believe it can be easily separated from memory. Among other problems with
separation, we tend to remember things which at the time we felt strongly 
about. Basically, I wasn't trying to give a complete description of my 
beliefs about the importance of memory, but a short summary. And as I've said
several times, our memories are important for our identity, if for no other
reason, because all the neuroscience I know suggests that their survival after
suspension is the most problematic of all. (Putting it another way, I can
see how awareness might be recovered, and human feelings can be recovered,
but AT THIS TIME its not obvious how we will recover our memories). 

As for the issue of WRONG values, I still don't think the word applies. This 
doesn't mean that I wouldn't try to pull someone I knew well back from jumping
over a cliff. It's simply that values are neither correct or incorrect any 
more than a mountain or a star is correct or incorrect. They exist. And yes,
they can and do change, but they do not change because of logical argument.
If some person has values which will (I notice) lead to their ultimate
destruction, I can say their values are self-destructive, too, but that is
not a logical argument against those values. My own best idea as to how to
argue with someone about values is to confront them with the consequences of
their values AND the fact that those consequences go against other values 
which they also have, ideally values they hold more strongly. Against someone
who is entirely consistent in wanting death I must either use force or 
give up. 

This issue, of course, becomes mixed up with the various kinds of insanity.
I may forcefully prevent a friend from jumping off a cliff not because the
friend will thank me at that time, but because I know that when his depression
lifts he will be glad I did so. Someone depressed feels that they, their
aspirations, and their person have no value. Here again, we are not dealing
in either logic or empirically proven truths about how they value themselves.
This is so even though the change in self-valuation does happen when their
depression goes away. Their values change, but not through logic or 
experiment. 

So that's what I have to say about "correct" values.

			Best and long long life to all,

				Thomas Donaldson

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