X-Message-Number: 9485
From: Ettinger <>
Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 11:24:04 EDT
Subject: BP/21CM Offer


In Cryonet #9483 Mike Darwin, speaking for himself and Brian Wowk, offers to
come to Michigan for three days to help CI improve its procedures.

I take the offer at face value, and thank them for it; and also thank Saul
Kent for approving the time off for it. However, I think we can do better at
less cost to everyone, as noted below. The improvements suggested are simple
and do not require personal instruction or demonstration.

First a couple of reminders. We have been well aware of these or/and similar
recommendations for a long time, but, as noted, we need to verify everything
in our own lab. We tried colloids on the sheep heads, for example, without
good results. (I would have to look up the notes to recall the details.) 

Mike's observations and opinions are often good, but not always. For example,
a couple of years ago he held a strong opinion that storing the CI solutions
in a refrigerator for months would result in growth of microorganisms. We took
that opinion seriously, and had solutions, after refrigerator storage for more
than a year, tested at a commercial lab. No microorganisms or other
contamination were found. We have the report on file. No solutions have been
stored longer than the tested period. 

(Jerry Leaf, good as he was, wasn't always right either. We proved he was
wrong about the feasibility of preparing our own water for injection.)

(Incidentally, Mazur's opinions or generalizations, so often quoted by Platt,
aren't always right either, such as the bad effects of slow cooling. Suda's
cat brains were cooled very slowly; and today Doug Skrecky has an interesting
post on Cryonet regarding the benefits of very slow cooling on rabbit kidneys.
Details! Conditions! Cases! Categories! That is why we insist on verifying
everything ourselves.)

So here is our response to the BP/21CM offer:

1. As to the items they offered to donate, we accept the donations with
thanks, at their convenience. 

2. As to their advice, we will try all applicable portions (after reviewing
what we have already done) as soon as our schedule permits. If we run into
problems on which we think they might provide helpful consultation by mail
etc., we will ask for it.  

Robert Ettinger
Cryonics Institute
Immortalist Society

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